Thursday, September 28, 2017


if there aren't any 'back channel' negotiations taking place between National and some of the more pragmatic Green MPs (perhaps facilitated by Dr Kennedy Graham).      Forget the ritualistic denials from camp Green ... reality sometimes produces unlikely bedfellows.

Consider this ... The National Party Blue/Green Special Interest Group is a force to be reckoned with in the Party.   They might be singing a different song from the Greens but its from the same songbook.   Consider this ... the junior party in a two party coalition has much more gravitas than would a junior party in a three way coalition deal.  Consider this ... two positions in cabinet (say Housing and Transport) and a third minister in the outer-cabinet (say Associate Social Welfare) stacks up much more than a couple of associate portfolios in the outer-cabinet likely under a Labour/NZF/Greens coalition deal noting that Winston has said that he won't sit with Green Party ministers at the same cabinet table ... and Winston is of course a man of his word ... snort, choke.

Yep ... dead rats all round but that's what MMP is all about and, with the departure of Me Tu and the pseudo-communist Catherine Delahunty, a more pragmatic Greens caucus might just have the nous to work out where they might get more bangs for their buck.


Johno said...

Isn't there an 'anti waka jumping' law now that prevents list MPs acting against their own party?

The Veteran said...

Johno ... not talking about waka-jumping; talking about the Greens making a pragmatic decision but, to answer your point, my understanding is that the anti waka-jumping law was time braided and expired a number of years ago. I don't recall any great desire to renew it with many taking the view that individual MPs must be able to act as their conscience dictated.

Psycho Milt said...

Consider this: National agrees to start taking climate change, waterway degradation and poverty seriously and actually doing something about them. No more mining and oil exploration, replacement of the ETS scam with a genuine price on carbon that includes agriculture, money earmarked for road building redirected to public transport, funding committed for cleaning up waterways, disincentives to agricultural intensification put in place, and probably a bunch of other things.

Consider it, then ask yourself how credible a Nat/Green coalition really is.

The Veteran said...

PM ... and all that is going to happen under a Labour/NZF/Greens coalition government ... in your wet dreams old son.

Remember MMP is the art of the possible and a strong voice in a strong government is infinitely better than a weak voice in a weak government.

Paranormal said...

The Greens won't be a junior partner in a three way with Labour/NZF. They'll be the left out ones giving confidence and supply.

Their refusal to even consider talking to National means they have nowhere else to go. Taxinda can walk all over them with impunity. What are they going to do - refuse to change the gummint like they've been campaigning for?

You'd think they would have learned from the Clark years.

Anonymous said...

National's big problem is that they have a lot of useless MPs.

Labour is just a group of resentful public servants and union hacks who haven't yet realised they have wasted their years on this planet. Imagine being a fly on the wall at the pearly gates.

The greens have a few with a decent morals, but a lot with a huge dose of entitlement baggage.

Winston first is just bat-shit crazy.

It is bloody depressing.

Psycho Milt said...

PM ... and all that is going to happen under a Labour/NZF/Greens coalition government ... in your wet dreams old son.

Sure. But would you prefer to work with people who are at least willing to make progress in your preferred direction, or people who stand opposed in principle to everything you stand for? The Greens know that working with people who are opposed to their basic values would be poison to their programme as well as to the environment. It would be on a par with National doing a deal to put a communist party in power, on the basis that there might be some policy concessions to be wrung out of it. Just. Not. Going. To. Happen. Get. Over. It.

Anonymous said...

How can anyone think the Greens are a green party? Any green tinge is solely for the purposes of getting votes from people who cannot see they are hard-left socialists. There is no alignment between the Greens and the centre-left National party.

Wilbur said...

This is fanciful stuff. The Green base have nothing but derision and contempt for the National Party who, rightly or wrongly, they perceive as stuffed shirt, money grubbing born to rule snobs. The Green base wouldn't wear such a move. Ever.

The brainiacs in the National Party should've thought more carefully about the ramifications of deliberately cannibalizing their own support parties in an MMP environment.

So now, the Nats either have to try and deal with Winnie or vacate the treasury benches, and Winnie will want to make them squirm as much as possible.

As they say, there are two things Winnie NEVER forgets. 1 - All of the fucks he's had and 2 - those he feels that have wronged him (Bill English and his incompetent bung eyed fool of a mate, Nick Smith for example)

Get the popcorn !

The Veteran said...

Wilbur ... I repeat what I said in an earlier post ... I now fully expect there to be a Labour/NZF/Greens government in place in two weeks hence. It will be a toxic trio with Winnie's mob torn apart by his backtracking on the Maori seats promise while the Green Party will be fed scraps from the table and told to stop interrupting the adults.

A Pyrrhic victory for the Greens.