Wednesday, May 2, 2018

DOES ANYONE WISH TO HAZARD A GUESS

why, in the commonwealth armies, a Major-General's rank insignia comprises a Second Lieutenant's single 'pip' over the crossed sword and baton while that of a Lieutenant-General comprises a Major's crown over the crossed sword and baton.

10 degrees in Wellington.   Bracing wind.

12 comments:

Noel said...

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sergeant_major_general

The Veteran said...

Noel ... yep, knew that, but it doesn't explain the insignia bit. Follow that through and logic might have dictated the crown from Sergeant-Major's insignia formed part of the Major-Generals insignia but instead the opted for a Second Lieutenant's pip with the Crown reserved for the Lieutenant-General.

The wonderful world of military logic.

Noel said...

Military logic hmmmm. Not sure if there is such a thing given the illogical decision not promote the RMA Sops. But I digress.

In 1885 the Major General was the Order of the Bath and remained for all of that ranks history.
It the fluctuations in the other ranks that changed and created the anomoly.
Back then a Lt Gen wore a crown but that changed by 1880 to a "pip" and a crown. Later the Bath plug been pulled.
It should be noted during that period Lieutenants wore a crown and Captains a crown and a "pip".

The Veteran said...

Noel ... fascinating. Can you reference that for me pse.

Gerald said...

Nothing illogical about the non promotion Noel. It was planned.
A group of people had reached the age for a condition before the majority of the rank and file did.
"When the Ministerial Group of Veterans Health reported back the reason the RMA Sops were not been advocated became clear. “Unlike the Australian Statement of Principles the approach that has been taken in New Zealand is that the time in theatre and factors relating to the levels of exposure do not need to be taken into consideration.”

Noel said...

"Looking Forward, Looking Back: Customs and Traditions of the Australian Army"
Walk in the wind to the National Library they should have a copy.

Johno said...

They should have got someone from the navy to sort this out. Army always gets this sort of thing arse about face.

Shelldrake said...

Thanks John. Vice admirals and Rear Admirals are a bit "Hello Sailor"

As for the Generals I recall an Army Publication titled "Why" (NZ P3) has a lot of info on Army Ranks and a myriad other Army traditions, history and associated subjects. Not sure where you can get your hands on one.

Johno said...

Damnit. Went fishing for Veteranus Irascabilis, but just boated a Shelldrakus Wrongfishus.

Oh well, toss it back.

Anonymous said...

The old title for a Major General is Sergeant Major General. It therefore a lesser rank than Lt General.

Gerald said...

Gunna toss a Sheldrakus Wrongfusus. Shame. Polluter.

Johno said...

It's ok, I handled it gently and it should swim away unharmed.