Friday, April 7, 2017


A respected colleague of mine has just e-mailed me a copy of 'Camaraderie' a publication of the Australian Defence Welfare Association.       You can access it here.

Scroll down to page 7 and the start of the article 'Insecticide Deceit' by Dr John Mordike.    It covers off the unrestricted use of chemicals including Dieldren and Chlordane within the 1 ATF Nui Dat base by the 1st Aust Hygiene Company.   It makes for salutatory reading.

Both Dieldren and Chloradane are rated 'Extremely Toxic' and in 2001 delegates from 120 countries meeting in Stockholm signed an international treaty banning them along with another ten other chemical compounds described as 'persistent organic pollutants which are the most dangerous of all manufactured products and toxic wastes and which cause fatal diseases and birth defects in animals and humans'.

Vietnam veterans have long argued they were exposed to a toxic environment outside the Nui Dat base as a result of aerial spraying.    This article would suggest they were more at risk back inside the 1 ATF base.

I know Lord Egbut has very firm views about our supposed exposure to Agent Orange and the like and I would welcome his (and others) take on these latest revelations.



Anonymous said...

Mission impossible...the subject is too complex to evaluate on these pages. Suffice it to say it has been looked at and found wanting. He is a historian not a toxicologist and has made several unsubstantiated claims and some of his assumptions like the spraying of malathion over Nui Dat every two weeks instead of once every six months as was the case and mistaking malathion as a residual compound has not heightened his credibility.

He fails to understand the first law of toxicology...The poison is in the dose.

The Vietnam veterans have 7% better mortality rate and the same number of reported birth defects as non vets so where is the effect that justifies looking for a cause?

I hope this does not run to a lot of posts with links to spurious scientific papers.

Lord Egbut

Noel said...

Amazing his source for the Hygiene Officers report to HQAFVis the Australian Army Report which NZDEf HQ never provided to any investigation.

Noel said...

Should have added that report as well as providing info on all Ranch Hand missions in Phuoc Tuy has a detailed section on jnsecticides.
Now when did NZDEF obtain their copy? Oh thats right 1982!

Noel said...

The dose makes the poison.
That's not as sure as it was 4 decades ago.

Egbutt given your position I am surprised you haven't been vocal on the change from Presumptive List to Conclusively Presumptive List.

The changes were made to ensure the conditions can never be challenged by evidence to the contrary.

The most obvious example is Spina Bifida which was dropped on the NAS matrix to the same level as all other children's conditions and removed from RMA SOPs.

Tinker Tailor Soldier Spy said...

I have to agree with Egbut. The subject is far to complex.

The submissions to the Waitangi Tribunal from a vocal group of Vietnam Veterans with cut and paste additions from second rate lawyers were farcical. Some were 'sprayed with Agent Orange' two years after all aerial herbicide spraying ceased in our AO!

For such a 'deadly poison' I wonder how it can be that so many of us are still in better health than many of our civilian counterparts 50 years after the event.

Noel said...

" For such a 'deadly poison' I wonder how it can be that so many of us are still in better health than many of our civilian counterparts 50 years after the event"

You appear to have a position similar to Egbutt.
Going to make a submission for the removal of the Conclusively Presumed list and reliance only
the RMA Sops?

Remember its not a level playing field.
The assumptions of the List enables claims to be settle in days where as RMA SOP claims will normally take two months or more.