Tuesday, August 18, 2009

No, not those families

For a brief moment I thought the headline "Well-off families rort system" meant the news media were finally starting to give National Party cabinet ministers the coverage they deserve, but no - just another "soften us up for gutting the welfare system" story. Sorry, but the news that the well-off weasel out of paying their taxes actually isn't news.

17 comments:

Adolf Fiinkensein said...

Come now Milt. I've just written out checks to IRD for over $50k and I'd happily pay Bill English another $100k per year if he deals to the real rorters - the ACT Party members with their family trusts and the Labour PArty members with their fake DPBs and the breen Party members with their sanctimonious LAQCs.

It's hard working National Party members like me who are paying for all these pricks.

Adolf Fiinkensein said...

Check? CHECKS?

"cheques" if you don't mind, Adolf!

Anonymous said...

The well-off are productive. They shouldn't have to pay taxes!
Its the non-productive bludgers we need to take out of NZ.

Andrei said...

Middle class families getting WFF are only getting some of their money back, for goodness sake - they are still paying taxes.

In the fifties when having children was encouraged you could claim for dependents, including a non working wife on your tax.

See my latest post for the consequences of not valuing families

Anonymous said...

Andrej, yeah I agree that middle class families are only getting some of their taxes back.

What about middle class single people, where do they get their taxes back?

It's discrimination, and every single one of these 9700 rorting families should be given criminal convictions for fraud and named and shames so we all know who they are.

Anonymous said...

Taxes BACK?

Fuck that, just leave the money with us in the first place! Only a stupid socialist who believes in control control control likes the WFF system and the wasteful admin money go round.
oooh youre so lucky we're giving you your money back.

Adolf Fiinkensein said...

Anonymous makes two very telling points. The third is that if WFF is killed off, then we can get rid of the thousand or so public servants who administer this money go round and allow them to find new and more productive empolyment.

JC said...

Once you take out the inevitably quoted top crooks, I think you'll find this is a middle class rort.

Houshold income of (say) $70,000 split between mum and dad, and claiming the WFF is not a rort by rich people but one of very middle income earners.

JC

Psycho Milt said...

I agree there's a problem to be addressed there - but who's going to address it? I'm at a loss to see how the Finance Minister who's himself been rorting the taxpayer for a grand a week, the Prime Minister who fully supported him, and their various cabinet colleagues who were engaged in similar rorts themselves, are going to avoid making themselves look anything but utterly laughable if they seek to end the rorts reported in the linked article. Any ideas?

Andrei said...

Its a values problem Milt, those troughing MPs are reflective of a society that has lost its way.

When Harry S Truman left office he didn't have any money - in fact is was so shameful they passed an act of congress to grant him (and all ex Presidents of the USA a pension.

Nor was Charles de Gaulle a rich man when he died, he actually declined the pensions he was entitled to as an ex President or an ex General tasking only a Colonels pension.

And in the sixties the press loved to mock Field Marshall Bernard Montgomery by photographing him cashing his Old age pensioners check implying he was troughing, when in fact it was all he had, after a lifetime of service to his country.

Can you see any of our modern elite behaving like this?

And if the leadership don't why would anybody else

JC said...

PM,

Lets just see where we are:

Key and the Speaker agreed to publishing the MP rorts, Bennett exposed the DPB rorts and now we have the middle/higher income WFF rorts laid out..

Thats already pretty comprehensive top to bottom and has to signal a strategy where up front incomes are the main income, allowances and entitlements get managed down and the major cause of all this.. tax gets flattened and hopefully reduced over time.

There's just one major flaw.. English says he needs tax money to feed the bureaucracy.. sorry, but when the Government is 42% of the economy compared to Oz at 34%.. he's missed one big bunch of bennies.

JC

Redbaiter said...

"Any ideas?"

Well, it sure wouldn't improve things one iota by electing any of your lot.

The politicians holding power at the moment have been elected by a voting bloc of bludgers and takers and they cannot afford to annoy their supporters by seriously cutting welfare benefits.

The politicians know, every one of them, that if they do so, they’ll have to give up their lunches at Bellamy’s and their chaffeur driven Beemers for the dole queue.

So they make noises, and shuffle the deck chairs, but the reality is that welfare is too deeply ingrained in the NZ psyche (see Andrei's comment for an example) for politicians to do any thing about it without losing their jobs.

The next government will be the same, and the one after that too, until the productive sector grows the balls and the nouse to stop paying these weak cowardly parasites to steal from them.

Long as you keep writing your cheques to Bill English Adolf, he will keep buying votes with the money.

Anonymous said...

Houshold income of (say) $70,000 split between mum and dad,


Household income of $70K doesn't make you "middle class" for fucks sake.


We need to reward excellence not mediocrity.


Frankly, a taxation system that took say a truly flat tax - say 10,000 of income from every man, woman, and child - and if you can't pay, well there is the workhouse! - and that's it!


And to reward excellence ,family income of over say 200K = no tax.

Anonymous said...

Don't believe everything you read in the paper guys. The IRD will still pay out this WFF even if you haven't claimed it in your return. So it is a govt system issue, not a "rort".

WAKE UP said...

When it comes to money, the only thing that trickles down is attitude.

ZenTiger said...

but the news that the well-off weasel out of paying their taxes actually isn't news.

Isn't that the equivalent of bashing beneficiaries?

Firstly, the "well off" are being defined as joint incomes of up to 100K and happen to have an investment property.

Secondly, the other "well off" people in the same income category who don't have investment properties, let alone trust accounts, are still paying a heap of tax, rather than your implied point they evade it.

Thirdly, the use of the term "rort" is only true in some cases, as the way the system was set up allowed the IRD to mistakenly pay people who qualified only because IRD failed to check the full range of income. It's possibly not their fault they'll get a huge bill to pay back.

The whole WFF setup was wrong from the outset (as I argued at outset). What is frightening is the idea that it can be corrected by instigating a CGT. No, that's not a correction, that's another tax, probably with loopholes for some to exploit whilst catching people that will pay up when they don't have to.

This government, and the previous, are chunder inspiring.

Psycho Milt said...

Secondly, the other "well off" people in the same income category who don't have investment properties, let alone trust accounts, are still paying a heap of tax...

Well, yeah - that would be me, among many others. I've no love for these freeloaders who welch on their taxes while constantly whinging about "bludgers," and most of them are, like me, well-off. But I agree that neither this govt nor the previous one could be looked to for leadership on the issue, devoted as they are/were to scamming taxpayers' money for their own investment properties.