Tuesday, June 23, 2009

Lost for an opinion, for once

I'm not sure what to make of the stuff going on in Iran, really.

On the one hand, it would be great to see the Iranians overthrow the ugly totalitarian theocracy that's blighted the place since overthrowing the previous blight in 1979. And on the other hand, we're constantly quacking on to people in the Middle East about how democracy is, but the moment a vote doesn't go our way we're wanting to see the violent overthrow of the winners.

On the one hand, it's certainly plausible that Ahmadinejad's govt rigged the ballot ridiculously in his favour. And on the other hand, it's also plausible that middle-class liberals in Tehran genuinely have no idea how popular Ahmadinejad's rule is in rural areas and among the proletariat - ie, it's entirely possible that Ahmadinejad did actally win the vote.

I guess on the whole I'm going with "Screw the finer details of democracy, just overthrow the dictatorship already" - but also don't think they've got much chance of actually doing it.


Rakaia George said...

PM - I heard a knowledgeable sounding bloke on the wireless with Maggie Barry a few days ago on this. With previous Iranian elections there would be some variation in the vote across the country, with local candidates having strong showings in their home towns etc.

This time around there has been a strikingly uniform pro-ArmedDinnerJacket vote across the country, so it does indeed look like the regime didn't rig the vote, it just wrote down and announced the numbers it wanted.

Falafulu Fisi said...

PM, thugs don't have legitimacy in holding the office of government. People have the rights to overthrow those. Hitler? He got to power legitimately, but he became a thug during his time in office. Anyone who tried to overthrow his government or assassinate him at the time, was perfectly legitimate according the definition of people's inalienable rights of what a government is for and the main reason it is there in the first place and that is to serve the people and not the other way round.

Hamas? The same thing. They need to be overthrown, because the rule by way of thuggery and they got voted by idiot populations who don't understand what's the limit of how a government can exercise its power. These idiots formally elected a government and they think there is all to it, where the government can please itself with whatever drastic brutal laws it can shove down the throats of its citizens . Forget the majority vote here for the moment and concentrate on the use of power by any sitting government. If they over-step their mandate in serving the people, then the people should overthrow them.

This is the reason why Western democracies should always promote about fair election even if the winner came legitimately to power via the majority of the idiots.

Now, do you see why western leaders are championing democracy and criticizing thugs who have been elected by idiots?

Finally, are you enjoying the riots in Tehran? I do. Not because I support the repression of the people by the security forces, but because I haven't seen the die-hard anti-Bush people like you (including overseas prominent politicians) proposed any solutions or even offer to help the Iranians, even a simple role such as mediating the opposing factions?

JC said...

Has the revolt spread throughout the country and away from the young in the very biggest cities? Have the unions and a whole bunch of other occupations and age groups joined in?

The answer is no.. not yet. And if this doesn't happen then the revolt is dead.

A million people marching is not much in a nation of 70 million.. particularly if it isn't representative of most of the people.

I very much dislike Obama, but I understand his caution in supporting what may be a not very well liked group of protesters.